GPS / Win CE installation problem

[Franc Zabkar]

I recently purchased this GPS device:
http://www.power-gps.com/en/chanpin/PWM-3501.html

Here is the instruction manual:
http://www.tempoaustralia.com.au/im...onmanuals/pwm-3501tevionInstructionmanual.pdf
(1.1 MB)

No driver is supplied for this device. Instead it is supposedly
supported natively by Windows. It suggests that the GPS Navigator and
its SD card appear like two standard "USB Mass storage Devices".
Unfortunately Windows ignores the Maximus Decim NUSB driver set when
searching for a suitable driver.

Here is how UVCview sees the device (without an SD card):
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/USB_IDs/PWM-3501.txt

idVendor: 0x045E = Microsoft Corporation
idProduct: 0x00CE

If anyone has installed a PDA or GPS device running Windows CE on a
Win98 box, I would be most grateful for an explanation as to how they
did it. I would also like to know how it appears under the HKLM\Enum
key in the registry, eg ...

CompatibleIDs
USB\CLASS_08&SUBCLASS_06&PROT_50,USB\CLASS_08&SUBCLASS_06,USB\CLASS_08


Here is an excerpt from the manual:

===================================================================
1. Data transferring

1. Start up your computer and connect it to the GPS navigator using
the USB cable.

2. Double click the “My computer” icon found on your desktop. Now you
will find two new icons named “removable disk”. The first icon
represents the navigator, and the second one represents SD/MMC card. A
new icon will also appear at the taskbar.

3. Double click the “removable Disk” in the folder.

4. Then copy, delete or move data into and out of the folder like any
traditional hard drive.

2. Disconnection

Click the icon on the bottom right of the taskbar with the left key of
the mouse, then click the “stop USB Mass storage Device-Driver” and
click the pop-up window named “USB Mass storage Device”.
===================================================================

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Jeff Richards]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

GPS devices don't need a driver. You connect it to a serial COM port and
set the port baud rate to 38,400 and the GPS data will be available. Just
make sure that your navigation software incudes the option of either setting
the baud rate to 38,400 or taking the Windows baud rate or auto-detecting
(38,400 is not standard for GPS data and some older navigation software did
not include options to use anything other than 4800).
--
Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)
"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message
news:53aff4l226hec4pf0itrfc0966chgcip8h@4ax.com...
>I recently purchased this GPS device:
> http://www.power-gps.com/en/chanpin/PWM-3501.html
>
> Here is the instruction manual:
> http://www.tempoaustralia.com.au/im...onmanuals/pwm-3501tevionInstructionmanual.pdf
> (1.1 MB)
>
> No driver is supplied for this device. Instead it is supposedly
> supported natively by Windows. It suggests that the GPS Navigator and
> its SD card appear like two standard "USB Mass storage Devices".
> Unfortunately Windows ignores the Maximus Decim NUSB driver set when
> searching for a suitable driver.
>
> Here is how UVCview sees the device (without an SD card):
> http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/USB_IDs/PWM-3501.txt
>
> idVendor: 0x045E = Microsoft Corporation
> idProduct: 0x00CE
>
> If anyone has installed a PDA or GPS device running Windows CE on a
> Win98 box, I would be most grateful for an explanation as to how they
> did it. I would also like to know how it appears under the HKLM\Enum
> key in the registry, eg ...
>
> CompatibleIDs
> USB\CLASS_08&SUBCLASS_06&PROT_50,USB\CLASS_08&SUBCLASS_06,USB\CLASS_08
>
>
> Here is an excerpt from the manual:
>
> ===================================================================
> 1. Data transferring
>
> 1. Start up your computer and connect it to the GPS navigator using
> the USB cable.
>
> 2. Double click the "My computer" icon found on your desktop. Now you
> will find two new icons named "removable disk". The first icon
> represents the navigator, and the second one represents SD/MMC card. A
> new icon will also appear at the taskbar.
>
> 3. Double click the "removable Disk" in the folder.
>
> 4. Then copy, delete or move data into and out of the folder like any
> traditional hard drive.
>
> 2. Disconnection
>
> Click the icon on the bottom right of the taskbar with the left key of
> the mouse, then click the "stop USB Mass storage Device-Driver" and
> click the pop-up window named "USB Mass storage Device".
> ===================================================================
>
> - Franc Zabkar
> --
> Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Franc Zabkar]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 08:49:55 +1100, "Jeff Richards"
<JRichards@msn.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>GPS devices don't need a driver. You connect it to a serial COM port and
>set the port baud rate to 38,400 and the GPS data will be available. Just
>make sure that your navigation software incudes the option of either setting
>the baud rate to 38,400 or taking the Windows baud rate or auto-detecting
>(38,400 is not standard for GPS data and some older navigation software did
>not include options to use anything other than 4800).

I have an old GPS that has a real RS232 port. It works as you
describe. However this latest device is USB only. It would need a
driver to emulate a COM port. In any case I'd like to use the data
transfer facility to exchange all files, not just GPS data.

BTW, the PWM-3501 is a multimedia AV player and E-book reader as well
as a GPS.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Jeff Richards]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

The serial port emulator software is supplied as part of the serial to USB
converter, or, where the converter is built-in as with this device, in the
software provided with the device itself.. However, it appears that the
device details in the product description refers to the GPS receiver as the
CE device sees it, and is not relevant to the connection between the CE
device and the PC. If you install navigation software on the CE device you
need to know that the GPS data is on COM7 at 38,400 baud. It is not clear
that the GPS data is actually available through the USB connection, which
makes it a bit useless for navigation.

To exchange files with the device, remove the SD card from the device and
plug it into the card reader attached to the PC, as for a digital camera.
When finished, re-insert it in the device.
--
Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)
"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message
news:67pff41b1g7vt8uemcfbnpg06rgn6d2cjp@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 08:49:55 +1100, "Jeff Richards"
> <JRichards@msn.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>
>>GPS devices don't need a driver. You connect it to a serial COM port and
>>set the port baud rate to 38,400 and the GPS data will be available. Just
>>make sure that your navigation software incudes the option of either
>>setting
>>the baud rate to 38,400 or taking the Windows baud rate or auto-detecting
>>(38,400 is not standard for GPS data and some older navigation software
>>did
>>not include options to use anything other than 4800).
>
> I have an old GPS that has a real RS232 port. It works as you
> describe. However this latest device is USB only. It would need a
> driver to emulate a COM port. In any case I'd like to use the data
> transfer facility to exchange all files, not just GPS data.
>
> BTW, the PWM-3501 is a multimedia AV player and E-book reader as well
> as a GPS.
>
> - Franc Zabkar
> --
> Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Franc Zabkar]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 16:20:04 +1100, "Jeff Richards"
<JRichards@msn.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>The serial port emulator software is supplied as part of the serial to USB
>converter, or, where the converter is built-in as with this device, in the
>software provided with the device itself.. However, it appears that the
>device details in the product description refers to the GPS receiver as the
>CE device sees it, and is not relevant to the connection between the CE
>device and the PC. If you install navigation software on the CE device you
>need to know that the GPS data is on COM7 at 38,400 baud. It is not clear
>that the GPS data is actually available through the USB connection, which
>makes it a bit useless for navigation.
>
>To exchange files with the device, remove the SD card from the device and
>plug it into the card reader attached to the PC, as for a digital camera.
>When finished, re-insert it in the device.

Thanks for the explanation. I eventually got the data transfers
working via USB, with the SD card in situ, using Microsoft's
ActiveSync version 3.8.

ActiveSync 3.x Desktop Software:
http://www.hpcfactor.com/support/syncsoft/activesync/
http://www.hpcfactor.com/ftp-root/software/microsoft/activesync/activesync-38/MSASYNC.EXE

The above site appears to be a comprehensive reference. As a total
novice, I found it very helpful.

The manual supplied with the GPS suggested that the device would
appear as two USB drives. This was not the case, at least not in
Win98SE. It was only when I delved into the Route66 manual on the CD
that I discovered a reference to ActiveSync.

Now the GPS appears in Device Manager as a "Microsoft USB Sync" device
under a new category named "Windows CE USB Devices".

The driver file is wceusbsh.sys, version 3.7.1.3244, date 12-6-2004.

There is no new device under the Disc Drives tab.

The GPS shows up in Explorer as a Mobile Device just below Dial-Up
Networking.

There are two ghost drives, both assigned the letter W:
Neither W: drive is accessible in a DOS window or in Explorer. The
error message is "W:\ is not accessible. This folder was moved or
removed."

The registry contains this new entry:
http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/GPS/PWM-3501_Tevion/wince.reg

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Enum\USB\VID_045E&PID_00CE]

[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Enum\USB\VID_045E&PID_00CE\INST_0]
"Capabilities"=hex:b4,00,00,00
"HardwareID"="USB\\VID_045E&PID_00CE&REV_0000,USB\\VID_045E&PID_00CE"
"CompatibleIDs"="USB\\CLASS_FF&SUBCLASS_FF&PROT_FF,USB\\CLASS_FF&SUBCLASS_FF,USB\\CLASS_FF"
"DeviceDesc"="Microsoft USB Sync"
"ClassGUID"="{25dbce51-6c8f-4a72-8a6d-b54c2b4fc835}"
"Class"="WCEUSBS"
"Driver"="WCEUSBS\\0000"
"Mfg"="Microsoft"
"ConfigFlags"=hex:00,00,00,00
"Serial"=hex:1a,00,00,00,00,00,00,00
"SymbolicName"="\\DosDevices\\000000000000001a#{a5dcbf10-6530-11d2-901f-00c04fb951ed}"

The SD card shows up as a folder named SDMMC in the root directory of
the Mobile Device. It does not appear as a separate drive.

When I r-click a Mobile Device file, I get an abridged context menu
consisting only of open/explore, cut/copy/paste,
create_shortcut/delete/rename, and properties.

If I try to backup any .cpl, .dll, or .exe files from the Windows
directory on the GPS, I run into an "access denied" error.

BTW, the GPS comes with the latest Australian maps from Route 66. The
package price is AU$139, whereas the maps alone cost US$180 (=AU$261).

See http://www.66.com/route66/index.php?cid=AU&act=1&prodid=5715

This begs the question, who is going to pay for a new map when they
can get a new GPS with the latest map for less?

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.

 

[Jeff Richards]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message
news:s5ikf4h8fs0dj8jkgekliujbdtgq2023s0@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 16:20:04 +1100, "Jeff Richards"
> <JRichards@msn.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:
>
>>The serial port emulator software is supplied as part of the serial to USB
>>converter, or, where the converter is built-in as with this device, in the
>>software provided with the device itself.. However, it appears that the
>>device details in the product description refers to the GPS receiver as
>>the
>>CE device sees it, and is not relevant to the connection between the CE
>>device and the PC. If you install navigation software on the CE device
>>you
>>need to know that the GPS data is on COM7 at 38,400 baud. It is not clear
>>that the GPS data is actually available through the USB connection, which
>>makes it a bit useless for navigation.
>>
>>To exchange files with the device, remove the SD card from the device and
>>plug it into the card reader attached to the PC, as for a digital camera.
>>When finished, re-insert it in the device.
>
> Thanks for the explanation. I eventually got the data transfers
> working via USB, with the SD card in situ, using Microsoft's
> ActiveSync version 3.8.

That's probably the preferred method for a mobile device in W98

> ActiveSync 3.x Desktop Software:
> http://www.hpcfactor.com/support/syncsoft/activesync/
> http://www.hpcfactor.com/ftp-root/software/microsoft/activesync/activesync-38/MSASYNC.EXE
>
> The above site appears to be a comprehensive reference. As a total
> novice, I found it very helpful.

It's worth looking through it in detail, especially re backup. In practice,
I prefer backing up to the device's own removable storage using the inbuilt
backup procedure. ActiveSync is OK for individual file transfers, and for
program installation. Some CE-device program installers require copying an
application to the device and then (perhaps) running an installer on the
device. The copying can be done either with ActiveSync or direct to the SD
card in a reader.

> The manual supplied with the GPS suggested that the device would
> appear as two USB drives. This was not the case, at least not in
> Win98SE. It was only when I delved into the Route66 manual on the CD
> that I discovered a reference to ActiveSync.

It's possible that drivers are required W98 but were not supplied, given
that ActiveSync is a viable alternative for W98 users.

> Now the GPS appears in Device Manager as a "Microsoft USB Sync" device
> under a new category named "Windows CE USB Devices".
>
> The driver file is wceusbsh.sys, version 3.7.1.3244, date 12-6-2004.

That's an ActiveSync driver.

> There is no new device under the Disc Drives tab.

That's correct. ActiveSync manages the device.

> The GPS shows up in Explorer as a Mobile Device just below Dial-Up
> Networking.
>
> There are two ghost drives, both assigned the letter W:
> Neither W: drive is accessible in a DOS window or in Explorer. The
> error message is "W:\ is not accessible. This folder was moved or
> removed."

That may be a leftover from failed attempts to install a driver for the
device.

> The registry contains this new entry:
> http://www.users.on.net/~fzabkar/GPS/PWM-3501_Tevion/wince.reg
>
> [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Enum\USB\VID_045E&PID_00CE]
>
> [HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Enum\USB\VID_045E&PID_00CE\INST_0]
> "Capabilities"=hex:b4,00,00,00
> "HardwareID"="USB\\VID_045E&PID_00CE&REV_0000,USB\\VID_045E&PID_00CE"
> "CompatibleIDs"="USB\\CLASS_FF&SUBCLASS_FF&PROT_FF,USB\\CLASS_FF&SUBCLASS_FF,USB\\CLASS_FF"
> "DeviceDesc"="Microsoft USB Sync"
> "ClassGUID"="{25dbce51-6c8f-4a72-8a6d-b54c2b4fc835}"
> "Class"="WCEUSBS"
> "Driver"="WCEUSBS\\0000"
> "Mfg"="Microsoft"
> "ConfigFlags"=hex:00,00,00,00
> "Serial"=hex:1a,00,00,00,00,00,00,00
> "SymbolicName"="\\DosDevices\\000000000000001a#{a5dcbf10-6530-11d2-901f-00c04fb951ed}"
>
> The SD card shows up as a folder named SDMMC in the root directory of
> the Mobile Device. It does not appear as a separate drive.

That's correct. And depending on the device features you may also have RAM
and ROM as root directory folders.

> When I r-click a Mobile Device file, I get an abridged context menu
> consisting only of open/explore, cut/copy/paste,
> create_shortcut/delete/rename, and properties.

That is standard for mobile devices. The functionality is provided by
ActiveSync, not Explorer, and is limted.

> If I try to backup any .cpl, .dll, or .exe files from the Windows
> directory on the GPS, I run into an "access denied" error.

That is correct for a mobile device. I think it's done because the file
formats are so different that copying individual files would create enormous
confusion.

> BTW, the GPS comes with the latest Australian maps from Route 66. The
> package price is AU$139, whereas the maps alone cost US$180 (=AU$261).
>
> See http://www.66.com/route66/index.php?cid=AU&act=1&prodid=5715
>
> This begs the question, who is going to pay for a new map when they
> can get a new GPS with the latest map for less?

Or pay for a new printer cartridge when the printer costs less than the
cartridges.

In order to use the device you still need to work out how the GPS data can
be routed to a virtual COM port through the USB connection. For isntance,
without this you won't be able to place yourself on a GoogleEarth display
running on the PC. Unfortunately, that's the type of detailed technical
information that manufacturers are very casual about, so you may need to
check out some of the specialist GPS device forums (fora?).

> - Franc Zabkar
> --
> Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
--
Jeff Richards
MS MVP (Windows - Shell/User)

 

[Franc Zabkar]

Re: GPS / Win CE installation problem

On Fri, 24 Oct 2008 12:20:17 +1100, "Jeff Richards"
<JRichards@msn.com.au> put finger to keyboard and composed:

>"Franc Zabkar" <fzabkar@iinternode.on.net> wrote in message
>news:s5ikf4h8fs0dj8jkgekliujbdtgq2023s0@4ax.com...

>> The GPS shows up in Explorer as a Mobile Device just below Dial-Up
>> Networking.
>>
>> There are two ghost drives, both assigned the letter W:
>> Neither W: drive is accessible in a DOS window or in Explorer. The
>> error message is "W:\ is not accessible. This folder was moved or
>> removed."
>
>That may be a leftover from failed attempts to install a driver for the
>device.

I deleted the following registry key, but the W: drives reappeared
after the device was redetected.

HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Enum\USB\VID_045E&PID_00CE

>> If I try to backup any .cpl, .dll, or .exe files from the Windows
>> directory on the GPS, I run into an "access denied" error.
>
>That is correct for a mobile device. I think it's done because the file
>formats are so different that copying individual files would create enormous
>confusion.

Total Commander (CE version) shows the affected files as being located
in ROM. I don't know why this should prevent them from being copied,
unless it is part of CE's file protections.

>> BTW, the GPS comes with the latest Australian maps from Route 66. The
>> package price is AU$139, whereas the maps alone cost US$180 (=AU$261).
>>
>> See http://www.66.com/route66/index.php?cid=AU&act=1&prodid=5715
>>
>> This begs the question, who is going to pay for a new map when they
>> can get a new GPS with the latest map for less?
>
>Or pay for a new printer cartridge when the printer costs less than the
>cartridges.
>
>In order to use the device you still need to work out how the GPS data can
>be routed to a virtual COM port through the USB connection. For isntance,
>without this you won't be able to place yourself on a GoogleEarth display
>running on the PC. Unfortunately, that's the type of detailed technical
>information that manufacturers are very casual about, so you may need to
>check out some of the specialist GPS device forums (fora?).

This particular device is unable to acquire any satellites from inside
the house, so that problem is moot. I have an old GPS, with an LED
display, that could do this job, though. It has a real serial port
which I have accessed via HyperTerminal.

- Franc Zabkar
--
Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.