Slow Performance issue

[David G. Hoch]

I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD storage
space available)

Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two users
are connected to the box.
Some of the performance issues reported include:
- Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
- Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in documents
- Choppy and broken up video streaming

In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made a very
small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.

Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or RDC,
and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are more
pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the HP
terminals.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.
--David

 

[Jeff Pitsch]

Re: Slow Performance issue

Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase the video is
never rendered by the card itself. Has the performance always been this
way? Have you tried updating the PC's themselves? How old are the PC's?

Jeff Pitsch
Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services

David G. Hoch wrote:
> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
> Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD storage
> space available)
>
> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two users
> are connected to the box.
> Some of the performance issues reported include:
> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in documents
> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>
> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
> built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made a very
> small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.
>
> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or RDC,
> and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are more
> pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the HP
> terminals.
>
> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
> Thanks.
> --David
>
>

 

[David G. Hoch]

Re: Slow Performance issue

The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but with slow
processors & small amounts of RAM. My understanding has been that the
performance of the PC is not particularly relevant once you open a thin
client session. Is that not a correct understanding?

Thanks.
--David


"Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase the video is
> never rendered by the card itself. Has the performance always been this
> way? Have you tried updating the PC's themselves? How old are the PC's?
>
> Jeff Pitsch
> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>
> David G. Hoch wrote:
>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
>> Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD storage
>> space available)
>>
>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two
>> users are connected to the box.
>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in
>> documents
>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>
>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
>> built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made a
>> very small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.
>>
>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or
>> RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are more
>> pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the HP
>> terminals.
>>
>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>> Thanks.
>> --David

 

[Jeff Pitsch]

Re: Slow Performance issue

Experience has shown me that this is incorrect. I have seen your exact
problem solved by upgrading the client especially when the problem seems
to not be the server itself.

Jeff Pitsch
Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services

David G. Hoch wrote:
> The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but with slow
> processors & small amounts of RAM. My understanding has been that the
> performance of the PC is not particularly relevant once you open a thin
> client session. Is that not a correct understanding?
>
> Thanks.
> --David
>
>
> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in message
> news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase the video is
>> never rendered by the card itself. Has the performance always been this
>> way? Have you tried updating the PC's themselves? How old are the PC's?
>>
>> Jeff Pitsch
>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>
>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
>>> Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD storage
>>> space available)
>>>
>>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two
>>> users are connected to the box.
>>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in
>>> documents
>>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>>
>>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
>>> built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made a
>>> very small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.
>>>
>>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or
>>> RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are more
>>> pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the HP
>>> terminals.
>>>
>>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>>> Thanks.
>>> --David
>
>

 

[DGH]

Re: Slow Performance issue

Jeff,

It certainly seems like you are correct that it could be a client hardware
performance issue since users on HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530) are not
experiencing the problem as much as users on PC's, but I'd love to find out
why this is. One of the concepts behind thin client computing, as I've
understood it, is that you eliminate concerns about client hardware. If you
look at the hardware specifications of the Thin Client Terminals (i.e.
800MHz processors, 128MB RAM, Zero hard drive) it suggests that you don't
need much to make a thin client session function well.

Is there any information that you've seen that discusses what negative
effects a PC might be having in this situation?

Thanks,
--David


"Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in message
news:u4%231YigOJHA.3876@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
> Experience has shown me that this is incorrect. I have seen your exact
> problem solved by upgrading the client especially when the problem seems
> to not be the server itself.
>
> Jeff Pitsch
> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>
> David G. Hoch wrote:
>> The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but with slow
>> processors & small amounts of RAM. My understanding has been that the
>> performance of the PC is not particularly relevant once you open a thin
>> client session. Is that not a correct understanding?
>>
>> Thanks.
>> --David
>>
>>
>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in
>> message news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase the video is
>>> never rendered by the card itself. Has the performance always been this
>>> way? Have you tried updating the PC's themselves? How old are the
>>> PC's?
>>>
>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>
>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
>>>> Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD
>>>> storage space available)
>>>>
>>>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two
>>>> users are connected to the box.
>>>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>>>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>>>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in
>>>> documents
>>>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>>>
>>>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
>>>> built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made a
>>>> very small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.
>>>>
>>>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or
>>>> RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are
>>>> more pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the HP
>>>> terminals.
>>>>
>>>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> --David
>>

 

[jolteroli]

Re: Slow Performance issue

your terminal server will send any (expensive) drawing of primitives (e.g.
draw a filled rectangle with color foo) to the client. now it's on the thin
client to rasterize this primitiv. if the thin client has no or less support
from the graphics driver/hardware, the cpu must do this memory intensive
operations.

if your granny PC is out of steam (and i bet it is), you'll experiencing
excatly the symptoms you describe.

you could try 16-bit color depth on the old PC's, or -- if you have -- try
replacing the graphics card by some old nvidia models (nv 5xxx) and such.
this probably will help.

-jolt

"DGH" <dhoch@dghtechnologies.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
news:49093de7$0$4892$607ed4bc@cv.net...
> Jeff,
>
> It certainly seems like you are correct that it could be a client hardware
> performance issue since users on HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530) are
> not experiencing the problem as much as users on PC's, but I'd love to
> find out why this is. One of the concepts behind thin client computing,
> as I've understood it, is that you eliminate concerns about client
> hardware. If you look at the hardware specifications of the Thin Client
> Terminals (i.e. 800MHz processors, 128MB RAM, Zero hard drive) it suggests
> that you don't need much to make a thin client session function well.
>
> Is there any information that you've seen that discusses what negative
> effects a PC might be having in this situation?
>
> Thanks,
> --David
>
>
> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in message
> news:u4%231YigOJHA.3876@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>> Experience has shown me that this is incorrect. I have seen your exact
>> problem solved by upgrading the client especially when the problem seems
>> to not be the server itself.
>>
>> Jeff Pitsch
>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>
>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>> The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but with slow
>>> processors & small amounts of RAM. My understanding has been that the
>>> performance of the PC is not particularly relevant once you open a thin
>>> client session. Is that not a correct understanding?
>>>
>>> Thanks.
>>> --David
>>>
>>>
>>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote in
>>> message news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>>> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase the video is
>>>> never rendered by the card itself. Has the performance always been
>>>> this way? Have you tried updating the PC's themselves? How old are
>>>> the PC's?
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>>
>>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard server.
>>>>> Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM; plenty of fast HD
>>>>> storage space available)
>>>>>
>>>>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only one or two
>>>>> users are connected to the box.
>>>>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>>>>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>>>>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to page in
>>>>> documents
>>>>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>>>>
>>>>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded the server's
>>>>> built-in video card to a card that has 256MB of RAM onboard. It made
>>>>> a very small improvement, but not enough to make the users happy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web Client, or
>>>>> RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP t5530). The problems are
>>>>> more pronounced on the PC's running Thin Client software than on the
>>>>> HP terminals.
>>>>>
>>>>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>> --David
>>>
>

 

[Vera Noest [MVP]]

Re: Slow Performance issue

Exactly. Check this as well:

Can I enhance graphics performance by installing a better video
card in the server?
http://ts.veranoest.net/ts_faq_performance.htm#video_card

_________________________________________________________
Vera Noest
MCSE, CCEA, Microsoft MVP - Terminal Server
TS troubleshooting: http://ts.veranoest.net
___ please respond in newsgroup, NOT by private email ___

"jolteroli" <jolt1976@gmx.net> wrote on 30 okt 2008 in
microsoft.public.windows.terminal_services:

> your terminal server will send any (expensive) drawing of
> primitives (e.g. draw a filled rectangle with color foo) to the
> client. now it's on the thin client to rasterize this primitiv.
> if the thin client has no or less support from the graphics
> driver/hardware, the cpu must do this memory intensive
> operations.
>
> if your granny PC is out of steam (and i bet it is), you'll
> experiencing excatly the symptoms you describe.
>
> you could try 16-bit color depth on the old PC's, or -- if you
> have -- try replacing the graphics card by some old nvidia
> models (nv 5xxx) and such. this probably will help.
>
> -jolt
>
> "DGH" <dhoch@dghtechnologies.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
> news:49093de7$0$4892$607ed4bc@cv.net...
>> Jeff,
>>
>> It certainly seems like you are correct that it could be a
>> client hardware performance issue since users on HP Thin Client
>> Terminals (HP t5530) are not experiencing the problem as much
>> as users on PC's, but I'd love to find out why this is. One of
>> the concepts behind thin client computing, as I've understood
>> it, is that you eliminate concerns about client hardware. If
>> you look at the hardware specifications of the Thin Client
>> Terminals (i.e. 800MHz processors, 128MB RAM, Zero hard drive)
>> it suggests that you don't need much to make a thin client
>> session function well.
>>
>> Is there any information that you've seen that discusses what
>> negative effects a PC might be having in this situation?
>>
>> Thanks,
>> --David
>>
>>
>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote
>> in message news:u4%231YigOJHA.3876@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>> Experience has shown me that this is incorrect. I have seen
>>> your exact problem solved by upgrading the client especially
>>> when the problem seems to not be the server itself.
>>>
>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>
>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>> The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but
>>>> with slow processors & small amounts of RAM. My
>>>> understanding has been that the performance of the PC is not
>>>> particularly relevant once you open a thin client session.
>>>> Is that not a correct understanding?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>> --David
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com>
>>>> wrote in message
>>>> news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>>>> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase
>>>>> the video is never rendered by the card itself. Has the
>>>>> performance always been this way? Have you tried updating
>>>>> the PC's themselves? How old are the PC's?
>>>>>
>>>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>>>
>>>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>>>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard
>>>>>> server. Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM;
>>>>>> plenty of fast HD storage space available)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only
>>>>>> one or two users are connected to the box.
>>>>>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>>>>>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>>>>>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to
>>>>>> page in documents
>>>>>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded
>>>>>> the server's built-in video card to a card that has 256MB
>>>>>> of RAM onboard. It made a very small improvement, but not
>>>>>> enough to make the users happy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web
>>>>>> Client, or RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP
>>>>>> t5530). The problems are more pronounced on the PC's
>>>>>> running Thin Client software than on the HP terminals.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>> --David

 

[DGH]

Re: Slow Performance issue

That's exactly the information I've been looking for.
Thanks very much for your help.

--David


"Vera Noest [MVP]" <vera.noest@remove-this.hem.utfors.se> wrote in message
news:Xns9B47DFC424107veranoesthemutforsse@207.46.248.16...
> Exactly. Check this as well:
>
> Can I enhance graphics performance by installing a better video
> card in the server?
> http://ts.veranoest.net/ts_faq_performance.htm#video_card
>
> _________________________________________________________
> Vera Noest
> MCSE, CCEA, Microsoft MVP - Terminal Server
> TS troubleshooting: http://ts.veranoest.net
> ___ please respond in newsgroup, NOT by private email ___
>
> "jolteroli" <jolt1976@gmx.net> wrote on 30 okt 2008 in
> microsoft.public.windows.terminal_services:
>
>> your terminal server will send any (expensive) drawing of
>> primitives (e.g. draw a filled rectangle with color foo) to the
>> client. now it's on the thin client to rasterize this primitiv.
>> if the thin client has no or less support from the graphics
>> driver/hardware, the cpu must do this memory intensive
>> operations.
>>
>> if your granny PC is out of steam (and i bet it is), you'll
>> experiencing excatly the symptoms you describe.
>>
>> you could try 16-bit color depth on the old PC's, or -- if you
>> have -- try replacing the graphics card by some old nvidia
>> models (nv 5xxx) and such. this probably will help.
>>
>> -jolt
>>
>> "DGH" <dhoch@dghtechnologies.com> schrieb im Newsbeitrag
>> news:49093de7$0$4892$607ed4bc@cv.net...
>>> Jeff,
>>>
>>> It certainly seems like you are correct that it could be a
>>> client hardware performance issue since users on HP Thin Client
>>> Terminals (HP t5530) are not experiencing the problem as much
>>> as users on PC's, but I'd love to find out why this is. One of
>>> the concepts behind thin client computing, as I've understood
>>> it, is that you eliminate concerns about client hardware. If
>>> you look at the hardware specifications of the Thin Client
>>> Terminals (i.e. 800MHz processors, 128MB RAM, Zero hard drive)
>>> it suggests that you don't need much to make a thin client
>>> session function well.
>>>
>>> Is there any information that you've seen that discusses what
>>> negative effects a PC might be having in this situation?
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> --David
>>>
>>>
>>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com> wrote
>>> in message news:u4%231YigOJHA.3876@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>> Experience has shown me that this is incorrect. I have seen
>>>> your exact problem solved by upgrading the client especially
>>>> when the problem seems to not be the server itself.
>>>>
>>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>>
>>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>>> The PC's are fairly old. They are running Windows XP, but
>>>>> with slow processors & small amounts of RAM. My
>>>>> understanding has been that the performance of the PC is not
>>>>> particularly relevant once you open a thin client session.
>>>>> Is that not a correct understanding?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>> --David
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "Jeff Pitsch" <jeff.pitsch.fake@jeffpitschconsulting.com>
>>>>> wrote in message
>>>>> news:OCpgMqeOJHA.4776@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
>>>>>> Upgrading the video card won't really do anything becuase
>>>>>> the video is never rendered by the card itself. Has the
>>>>>> performance always been this way? Have you tried updating
>>>>>> the PC's themselves? How old are the PC's?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jeff Pitsch
>>>>>> Microsoft MVP - Terminal Services
>>>>>>
>>>>>> David G. Hoch wrote:
>>>>>>> I'm running Terminal Sevices on a Windows 2003 Standard
>>>>>>> server. Fairly powerful box (1xQuad-Core Proc; 4GB RAM;
>>>>>>> plenty of fast HD storage space available)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Users are seeing poor performance at times, even when only
>>>>>>> one or two users are connected to the box.
>>>>>>> Some of the performance issues reported include:
>>>>>>> - Slow opening of data files (.PDF, .DOC, etc.)
>>>>>>> - Once opened, slow and/or choppy scrolling from page to
>>>>>>> page in documents
>>>>>>> - Choppy and broken up video streaming
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In order to fix the video streaming problem I've upgraded
>>>>>>> the server's built-in video card to a card that has 256MB
>>>>>>> of RAM onboard. It made a very small improvement, but not
>>>>>>> enough to make the users happy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Interestingly, we are using some PC's running either TS Web
>>>>>>> Client, or RDC, and some HP Thin Client Terminals (HP
>>>>>>> t5530). The problems are more pronounced on the PC's
>>>>>>> running Thin Client software than on the HP terminals.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>> --David