Windows Vista Various ways to escalate to admin

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Dick

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I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in. I
am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following methods
at one time or another:

1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
request to provide admin credentials

2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials

3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
prompt to approve escalation

4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation

The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program will
work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to just
installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc, etc. I
would like to remain a regular user and supply admin credentials as
required. But that doesn't always work.

How does one know which method to use?

I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?

Thanks in advance...

Dick
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

No takers, eh...

Well, I guess that everyone is as confused as I am or the answer is so
obvious that no one bothers to reply.

Thanks anyway...

Dick

"Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:%23ZnoALTCJHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
>when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
>escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
>account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in. I
>am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following methods
>at one time or another:
>
> 1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
> request to provide admin credentials
>
> 2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
> administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials
>
> 3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
> prompt to approve escalation
>
> 4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
> administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation
>
> The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program will
> work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to just
> installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc, etc. I
> would like to remain a regular user and supply admin credentials as
> required. But that doesn't always work.
>
> How does one know which method to use?
>
> I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
> confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
> Dick
>
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

No takers, eh...

Well, I guess that everyone is as confused as I am or the answer is so
obvious that no one bothers to reply.

Thanks anyway...

Dick


"Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:%23ZnoALTCJHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
>when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
>escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
>account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in. I
>am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following methods
>at one time or another:
>
> 1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
> request to provide admin credentials
>
> 2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
> administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials
>
> 3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
> prompt to approve escalation
>
> 4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
> administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation
>
> The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program will
> work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to just
> installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc, etc. I
> would like to remain a regular user and supply admin credentials as
> required. But that doesn't always work.
>
> How does one know which method to use?
>
> I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
> confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?
>
> Thanks in advance...
>
> Dick
>
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

Hi,

That's because there's no one answer. Elevation varies by task and program.
Admin credentials are needed to run certain tasks or to modify/alter/add to
system folders. Programs designed for Vista should never need elevation
except perhaps for installation. Others, run in compatibility mode, may
require elevation for certain routines to run.

> How does one know which method to use?

Use whichever one works to accomplish the task. Vista is designed to
implement and respond to these types of requests in various ways, what you
are seeing is the result of this. Even an administrator account is not run
with elevation to prevent malware from quietly usurping it to install itself
sight unseen. So, even when running with this level account you will still
get the same prompts as when run with a regular user account. The difference
being under a regular user account you must supply admin credentials to
complete the task. When run under admin, you must simply acknowledge it.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com

"Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:unGnIjqCJHA.5060@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
> No takers, eh...
>
> Well, I guess that everyone is as confused as I am or the answer is so
> obvious that no one bothers to reply.
>
> Thanks anyway...
>
> Dick
>
>
> "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:%23ZnoALTCJHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
>>when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
>>escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
>>account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in. I
>>am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following
>>methods at one time or another:
>>
>> 1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
>> request to provide admin credentials
>>
>> 2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>> administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials
>>
>> 3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
>> prompt to approve escalation
>>
>> 4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>> administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation
>>
>> The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program will
>> work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to just
>> installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc, etc. I
>> would like to remain a regular user and supply admin credentials as
>> required. But that doesn't always work.
>>
>> How does one know which method to use?
>>
>> I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
>> confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?
>>
>> Thanks in advance...
>>
>> Dick
>>
>
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

Thanks, Rick, for the insight. However, I think that my point was missed.
Perhaps I didn't explain it properly. If I take a given executable, say an
install, and let's assume that it IS NOT written explicitly for Vista. I
would have assumed that whether I ran this executable as an admin (with the
appropriate UAC prompt) or as a standard user (with the prompt for admin
credentials), I would end up with the exact same results. But in fact, I
find that I do not end up with the same results. In one case, the installed
program would not run properly.

Again, which ever method that I use (as indicated previously (in the
original post), I expected the END RESULT to be the same. Can you shed any
light on this?

I appreciate you taking the time on this...

Dick

"Rick Rogers" <rick@mvps.org> wrote in message
news:epjuQDrCJHA.4804@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
> Hi,
>
> That's because there's no one answer. Elevation varies by task and
> program. Admin credentials are needed to run certain tasks or to
> modify/alter/add to system folders. Programs designed for Vista should
> never need elevation except perhaps for installation. Others, run in
> compatibility mode, may require elevation for certain routines to run.
>
>> How does one know which method to use?
>
> Use whichever one works to accomplish the task. Vista is designed to
> implement and respond to these types of requests in various ways, what you
> are seeing is the result of this. Even an administrator account is not run
> with elevation to prevent malware from quietly usurping it to install
> itself sight unseen. So, even when running with this level account you
> will still get the same prompts as when run with a regular user account.
> The difference being under a regular user account you must supply admin
> credentials to complete the task. When run under admin, you must simply
> acknowledge it.
>
> --
> Best of Luck,
>
> Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
> Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
> My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com
>
> "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:unGnIjqCJHA.5060@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>> No takers, eh...
>>
>> Well, I guess that everyone is as confused as I am or the answer is so
>> obvious that no one bothers to reply.
>>
>> Thanks anyway...
>>
>> Dick
>>
>>
>> "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:%23ZnoALTCJHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
>>>when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
>>>escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
>>>account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in.
>>>I am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following
>>>methods at one time or another:
>>>
>>> 1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives
>>> a request to provide admin credentials
>>>
>>> 2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>>> administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials
>>>
>>> 3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
>>> prompt to approve escalation
>>>
>>> 4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>>> administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation
>>>
>>> The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program will
>>> work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to just
>>> installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc, etc. I
>>> would like to remain a regular user and supply admin credentials as
>>> required. But that doesn't always work.
>>>
>>> How does one know which method to use?
>>>
>>> I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
>>> confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?
>>>
>>> Thanks in advance...
>>>
>>> Dick
>>>
>>
>
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

On Sat, 30 Aug 2008 18:57:56 -0400, "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net>
wrote:

>Thanks, Rick, for the insight. However, I think that my point was missed.
>Perhaps I didn't explain it properly. If I take a given executable, say an
>install, and let's assume that it IS NOT written explicitly for Vista. I
>would have assumed that whether I ran this executable as an admin (with the
>appropriate UAC prompt) or as a standard user (with the prompt for admin
>credentials), I would end up with the exact same results. But in fact, I
>find that I do not end up with the same results. In one case, the installed
>program would not run properly.
>
>Again, which ever method that I use (as indicated previously (in the
>original post), I expected the END RESULT to be the same. Can you shed any
>light on this?
>
>I appreciate you taking the time on this...

Get it from the horse's mouth. Listen to the entire hour long taped
interview of the two author's of UAC and in spite of them trying to
put on a brave face you'll discover for yourself why it is so screwed
up in implementation. Even they do a sort of shoulder shrug and meekly
ask for those having problems to let them know.

http://channel9.msdn.com/shows/Going+Deep/UAC-What-How-Why/
 
Re: Various ways to escalate to admin

Hi Dick,

This meanst that the program, not being designed for Vista, is also trying
to run/execute from the Program Files directory rather than being
virtualized within the user environment that is the standard in Vista. To
run the program you will also need to use the right-click/run as admin or
enable elevation in the properties of the shortcut/icon for it.

--
Best of Luck,

Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com

"Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:eKJ6LPvCJHA.4916@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
> Thanks, Rick, for the insight. However, I think that my point was missed.
> Perhaps I didn't explain it properly. If I take a given executable, say
> an install, and let's assume that it IS NOT written explicitly for Vista.
> I would have assumed that whether I ran this executable as an admin (with
> the appropriate UAC prompt) or as a standard user (with the prompt for
> admin credentials), I would end up with the exact same results. But in
> fact, I find that I do not end up with the same results. In one case, the
> installed program would not run properly.
>
> Again, which ever method that I use (as indicated previously (in the
> original post), I expected the END RESULT to be the same. Can you shed
> any light on this?
>
> I appreciate you taking the time on this...
>
> Dick
>
> "Rick Rogers" <rick@mvps.org> wrote in message
> news:epjuQDrCJHA.4804@TK2MSFTNGP02.phx.gbl...
>> Hi,
>>
>> That's because there's no one answer. Elevation varies by task and
>> program. Admin credentials are needed to run certain tasks or to
>> modify/alter/add to system folders. Programs designed for Vista should
>> never need elevation except perhaps for installation. Others, run in
>> compatibility mode, may require elevation for certain routines to run.
>>
>>> How does one know which method to use?
>>
>> Use whichever one works to accomplish the task. Vista is designed to
>> implement and respond to these types of requests in various ways, what
>> you are seeing is the result of this. Even an administrator account is
>> not run with elevation to prevent malware from quietly usurping it to
>> install itself sight unseen. So, even when running with this level
>> account you will still get the same prompts as when run with a regular
>> user account. The difference being under a regular user account you must
>> supply admin credentials to complete the task. When run under admin, you
>> must simply acknowledge it.
>>
>> --
>> Best of Luck,
>>
>> Rick Rogers, aka "Nutcase" - Microsoft MVP
>> http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/
>> Windows help - www.rickrogers.org
>> My thoughts http://rick-mvp.blogspot.com
>>
>> "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
>> news:unGnIjqCJHA.5060@TK2MSFTNGP03.phx.gbl...
>>> No takers, eh...
>>>
>>> Well, I guess that everyone is as confused as I am or the answer is so
>>> obvious that no one bothers to reply.
>>>
>>> Thanks anyway...
>>>
>>> Dick
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dick" <rsutton43@comcast.net> wrote in message
>>> news:%23ZnoALTCJHA.5316@TK2MSFTNGP04.phx.gbl...
>>>>I am confused as to when to use which method of privilege escalation and
>>>>when. For example, there are at least 4 different ways to perform
>>>>escalation and they seem to produce different results. I have an admin
>>>>account defined and a regular user account that I do 99% of my work in.
>>>>I am using Vista Home Premium, by the way. I have used the following
>>>>methods at one time or another:
>>>>
>>>> 1) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives
>>>> a request to provide admin credentials
>>>>
>>>> 2) regular user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>>>> administrator' and receives a request to provide admin credentials
>>>>
>>>> 3) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) and receives a
>>>> prompt to approve escalation
>>>>
>>>> 4) admin user executes a setup.exe program (for example) with 'run as
>>>> administrator' and receives a prompt to approve escalation
>>>>
>>>> The problem is, many times the results are different. Some program
>>>> will work with one method but not another. I am not limiting this to
>>>> just installs: it could be copying files or making directories, etc,
>>>> etc. I would like to remain a regular user and supply admin
>>>> credentials as required. But that doesn't always work.
>>>>
>>>> How does one know which method to use?
>>>>
>>>> I can't believe it's a trial and error procedure. Am I the only one
>>>> confused here? What am I missing? What am I not getting?
>>>>
>>>> Thanks in advance...
>>>>
>>>> Dick
>>>>
>>>
>>
>
 
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